So while Times staff members may vote, they are not allowed to endorse or campaign for candidates or political causes. They targeted somebody from the Justice Department, and I wrote they also targeted FBI employees. And as part of this effort, Richard Seddon was brought on to handle training and really professionalize Project Veritas' undercover operations. And he was pitching that plan, but it never got anywhere. Let me reintroduce you. GOLDMAN: Yeah. Erik Prince, founder of the private security firm Blackwater, filed a defamation lawsuit against The Intercept last month over an article published in 2020 that examined his efforts to sell. DAVIES: Do we know of connections between Project Veritas and James O'Keefe and Trump, Donald Trump or the Trump family? Several of them confirmed their donations. It's a conservative group, and they conduct undercover operations, for instance, to expose bias or what they would describe as, you know, wrongdoing primarily in liberal circles. They need some spy training and covert military, paramilitary training at his ranch. Last year, the group received a $1 million contribution made through the law firm Alston & Bird, a financial document obtained by The New York Times showed. Their attorneys wrote that the story did not focus its efforts on or in Wyoming, nor would it have any reason to do so . GOLDMAN: I was going to say, you know, talking to Republicans, moderate Republicans, I mean, moderate - these guys are pretty conservative, by the way - when we're describing it as moderate Republicans they were targeting. zoneId = 'Array'; This item is available in full to subscribers. Is he actually providing those kinds of services? Is this stuff a crime? But before the parties get to the lawsuits merits, The Intercept is contending, among other arguments, that Wyoming is not the right place for the case to be heard. GOLDMAN: I believe that O'Keefe has interacted with Trump. And so, you know, I can't tell you right now it hasn't, that somebody else isn't doing this. They were, in fact, going to use a former Project Veritas operative named Tarah Price, who lives in the Dallas area, to, you know, possibly ensnare McMaster at a restaurant, get him to say something ill toward or maybe negative about Trump, something that would compromise him. We're going to take a break here. DAVIES: Now, one of the more well-known operations - because, well, you reported on this - was an effort to embarrass Trump's national security adviser, H.R. DAVIES: Wow. Prince to help him secure funding is just one of the new details about Mr. Seddons operation revealed in documents obtained by The Times and interviews with people familiar with his plans. And, you know, we wrote the story about the operation targeting McMaster and Georgetown. if( width > 480 ){ You know, this is something we haven't seen, right? GOLDMAN: Yeah. In the case of the FBI, you know, they were looking for bias to see if somebody - they could get somebody to say something anti-Trump, which, of course, fit the theme at the time because, you know, these infamous text messages between these two FBI officials who had worked on the Russia investigation - the FBI's Russia investigation had come out, right? But what we know is there was an arrangement made, and Erik Prince allowed Project Veritas to use his farm to train its operatives. In a Jan. 15 order, U.S. District Court Judge Alan Johnson of Cheyenne tossed out Prince's defamation lawsuit against The Intercept. And in the end, you know, O'Keefe would release them and, you know, make a big deal out of them. And they received what was essentially clandestine training at a ranch in Wyoming that's owned by the family of Erik Prince. Prince and former British spy Richard Seddon both did work for the organization. document.write ("&loc=" + escape(window.location)); DAVIES: When Richard Seddon and Erik Prince got connected with Veritas and cooperated on some of these operations, what was the effect on Veritas? But (laughter) this seemed to be the training out in Wyoming. What are traditional political dirty tricks? GOLDMAN: In some instances, they were on, you know, these social - these dating apps, right? I know that, you know, one of the first instances of his association with this - or maybe the first instance of his association - was in an Intercept article in which O'Keefe had posted a picture of himself firing a pistol with a silencer on Instagram. Prince turned to Mr. Seddon to help train the Project Veritas operatives. But he was extremely wealthy conservative in Wyoming named Foster Friess, who had actually run for governor in '18. Now, you mentioned Project Veritas. And then on a parallel but different track, you know, Sofia is trying to make her way through the Young Democrats of Wyoming, the Wyoming Democratic Party, you know, building her bona fides as an eager, young Democrat. Erik Prince, founder of private . GOLDMAN: Yeah, I would say an active - sure, an active player in certain parts of Trump's world, yeah, or conservative - the conservative world. It's not clear to me how close he is to Trump. You know, Princes are pretty savvy. Not saying this is the case with Mr. O'Keefe, but it's sort of hard to fundraise that way if you're only doing one thing a year or if it's - you know, there are long periods of silence between each expose. We're speaking with New York Times reporter Adam Goldman, one of a team of Times reporters who've been writing about an effort by conservatives to train operatives in undercover operations to infiltrate progressive groups, unions and the offices and campaigns of Democratic and moderate Republican candidates and elected officials. Erik Prince, a political novice and former Navy SEAL who made a fortune in contracting security services to the U.S. Military, said in an interview with Breitbart that he will announce in the coming weeks whether he will challenge Barrasso in the Republican primary. What kind of inroads did they make? This includes participating in marches or rallies in support of a movement or giving money to, or raising money for, any political candidate or election cause. I don't know. Currently, Prince leads a Hong Kong-based firm providing security, logistics, insurance and infrastructure services in parts of Africa and other high-conflict areas. The campaign discovered the operative and fired her. The parties are currently awaiting a ruling from Judge Johnson, who could choose to allow the case to proceed in Wyoming; permit some more limited fact-gathering about the appropriate jurisdiction; transfer the case to New York; or throw it out entirely. But I didn't reveal that I knew Beau and Sofia had lived at that house at the time because we were working - concurrently, we were working on this larger story about them. There's an annual one, Nellie T. Ross Banquet, and I believe it's in Cheyenne every February. It was unclear whether Mr. Seddon was involved in planning that operation. And this is FRESH AIR. So they were looking to mine that, to exploit that territory. Separately, Ms. Gore unsuccessfully tried to raise money for the project from Foster Friess, a billionaire Wyoming businessman, during a January 2019 meeting, three people said. But the effort is a glimpse of a vigorous private campaign to try to undermine political groups or individuals perceived to be in opposition to Mr. Trumps agenda. And they would secretly record them, you know, and create content and then eventually, you know, release a video, like they did in several instances. Both operations were run by Project Veritas, a conservative group that has gained attention using hidden cameras and microphones for sting operations on news organizations, Democratic politicians and liberal advocacy groups. Erik Prince, founder of the private military firm Blackwater, helped raise money for a political-intelligence operation run by Richard Seddon, a former British spy. That was certainly a catalyst. McMaster? if (document.mmm_fo) document.write ("&mmm_fo=1"); I don't know. The job put her in a position to gain valuable information about which Republican candidates the group was supporting with independent advertising. GOLDMAN: It's my understanding that they met during a training at the Prince ranch in Wyoming in the spring of '17 and then grew closer over time. And he ends up giving, you know, $6,000 to Wyoming Democratic Party and also money to other political figures. So flesh out the picture a bit. Beau picks up - starts working this marijuana legalization angle to try to make contacts with people - elected officials who are, in fact, pushing this bill to legalize marijuana. But when I learned about Beau and Sofia last year - there's a website, Project Veritas Exposed. - trying to find, you know, damaging information on, you know, on political rivals, you know, using, you know, private investigative firms. And as I was reporting this, somebody said, well, you know, her picture, you know, she's on that website. What's interesting about that Instagram post - and you can see it yourself, it's still out there - they like to describe themselves as journalists. Mr. Seddons role in the teachers union operation detailed in internal Project Veritas emails that have emerged from the discovery process of a court battle between the group and the union has not previously been reported, nor has Mr. Princes role in recruiting Mr. Seddon for the groups activities. DAVIES: So how did you come upon this couple, Beau and Sofia? He's a former British intelligence officer who served in Washington, D.C., and in Pakistan and eventually leaves the British Secret Intelligence Service and develops some relationship with Erik. They had a private security firm. And this photo of James O'Keefe, who's, you know, the founder of Project Veritas, firing a weapon with a silencer, apparently, at Erik Prince's ranch - were they being trained in firearms there? And as we quoted an expert in our story, you know, if there's a sudden pattern of somebody giving money to the Democrats and they had never done that before, you know, that could also raise suspicions. GOLDMAN: No. They were, in fact, undercover spies who had been building a cover as eager Democrats when, in fact, they were anything but that. And then they married last week. Ms. Gore ended up rejecting the proposal because it was too expensive people with knowledge of the plan said it would start in the hundreds of thousands of dollars. Erik Prince, founder of private security contractor Blackwater and brother of former Education Secretary Betsy DeVos, recruited a former British spy in 2016 to professionalize the undercover. MATTHEW COLE: In. She and Mr. James OKeefe, a conservative activist, founded Project Veritas. Along with gathering intel, Maier and LaRocca sought to bait individuals associated with Better Wyoming into making statements they could secretly record and hand over to their clients. I think it was called "Deep State Exposed" or "Deep State Uncovered." Both Project Veritas and Mr. At the time, Prince was exploring the possibility of mounting a Republican primary challenge to incumbent U.S. Sen. John Barrasso, R-Wyo. And so Sofia's picture was up there. By Derek Royden - July 2, 2021 2466 SOURCE NationofChange - and, you know, that probably in terms of, you know, Iran - not pulling out of the agreement with Iran, the JCPOA, and, you know, McMaster, you know, wanting to keep, I guess, troops in Afghanistan. This is FRESH AIR. You know, they targeted the teachers unions. So what I'm saying is from Richard Seddon's standpoint, the fact that she had a picture up on Project Veritas Exposed, that was a real risk they were taking, right? He gave the examples of Jones Creek and CMNS Systems. However, neither of those entities appear to be registered to do business in Wyoming; the only reference the Tribune could find to a company named CMNS Systems was an LLC formed in Delaware in August months after Prince filed his suit. In apparent response to inquiries from the Tribune about the two companies ties to Wyoming, Princes revised declaration said he misidentified the names of the entities. But, you know, over 18, they - it grew closer. The New York Times published an article chronicling a Wapiti, Wyoming-based espianoge effort. Prince said he regularly host[s] customers, investors, employees and other business associates at my Wyoming ranch.. Mr. Seddon was a longtime British intelligence officer who served around the world, including in Washington in the years after the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001. GOLDMAN: Yeah. All rights reserved. For example, Rolling Stone published an investigative piece in October, The New York Times broke the news of Princes potential run on Oct. 8, 2017, in another interview with Breitbart a few days later, identified the site as the Prince ranch in a 2019 article, asserting Prince participated in a plan to dampen turnout among Black voters, Powered by Creative Circle Media Solutions. Mr. And, you know, and he is - you know, he's an international businessman. During a meeting in a Las Vegas suburb last April of employees of Ms. Gores organization, the Wyoming Liberty Group, Mr. Seddon pitched a proposal to build a website where other so-called preppers could buy their own supplies and communicate with each other in the event of what he called a Black Swan moment a major terrorist attack, another pandemic or a civil war. This is FRESH AIR. I mean, this is - you know, he no doubt sees them as a conservative ally, like other conservative networks. And GOLDMAN: Involving Roy Moore - exactly. Mr. Seddon and Ms. Gore did not respond to messages. DAVIES: Did any of these result in resignations, firings, criminal investigations GOLDMAN: You know, and in the end, the people who were involved, I think, were, you know, slightly humiliated. Prince is under investigation by the Justice Department over whether he lied to a congressional committee examining Russian interference in the 2016 election, and for possible violations of American export laws. And it all kind of went south when the Post exposed it. Sofia makes a contribution - a small contribution to a woman she had befriended who ran, unsuccessfully, for the Wyoming state legislature. GOLDMAN: The Georgetown house in D.C. was used as a base to, you know, essentially launch these undercover operations in the summer of '18, I guess, into the fall and maybe later. WASHINGTON Erik Prince, the security contractor with close ties to the Trump administration, has in recent years helped recruit former American and British spies for secretive. "He's a very nice man," Prince said of Barrasso in the Breitbart interview. It also seems, to me, murky. Princes parents, Elsa Prince and the late Edgar Prince, bought the 940-acre Double E Ranch in the Wapiti Valley in the early 1990s. No one tells Project Veritas who or what to investigate, he said. Previously, he covered national security for The Washington Post and worked on the investigative team at the Associated Press, where he and his colleagues revealed the New York Police Department's Muslim spying programs. Funneling contributions through a third party is a feature of the federal election code and most state election codes. You know, he's a businessman. But I don't know how close they are. 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